Skip to content

Nestlé

N

Interviewee

53 Art Director; Creative

Team Advantages

Team Disadvantages

0, 2

Project Outcome

Unsuccessful

Industry

Food

Location

Chicago

Team Risk Tolerance

Low

Team Dynamics

TeamDynamics_Burnout

Company

Nestlé


I think something that both of us worked on started off really well, and then totally fell out of place, which was Stouffer's. We worked on a big brand campaign for Stouffer's, and had to rethink the whole ... Their whole approach. Their whole communication. Would you agree? [3933]
It's interesting to compare the two, because Stouffer's should be as clear-cut and defined as Lean Cuisine, but it's this group that we work with on theirs is brutal. [3223]
It basically comes down to showing her executions as opposed to getting her to buy off on a concept first. It's the polar opposite of how the Unilever guys are able to understand a big picture concept, and then let the work be created. And on Stouffer's, she thinks she gets the big picture concept, but then she can't buy off on it until she sees it actually executed. So she gets caught up in executional details and it just wastes so much time and energy. And it ends up being something that is just really watered down and not that interesting. And then it doesn't perform very well. That happens on everything we do for them [3250],[3251],[3224]
We have a client who thinks she knows what she wants to see, but she's unable to verbalize it. So it's kind of like a cat and mouse game, and it just ends up eating so much ... It basically comes down to showing her executions as opposed to getting her to buy off on a concept first. It's the polar opposite of how the Unilever guys are able to understand a big picture concept, and then let the work be created. And on Stouffer's, she thinks she gets the big picture concept, but then she can't buy off on it until she sees it actually executed. So she gets caught up in executional details and it just wastes so much time and energy. And it ends up being something that is just really watered down and not that interesting. And then it doesn't perform very well. That happens on everything we do for them. [3252],[3253],[3227],[3226],[3228],[3229],[3225]
Well, we actually just lost them. They're moving to the New York office, because the relationship has just finally gotten so ... It's just brutal. It's like working with a boyfriend you broke up with. [3254],[3230],[3255],[3231]
Well, the process started out where we wanted to own ... We wanted to own dinnertime, and so we did a lot of work against that, and we came up with some great ways I think of doing it, we had everything covered, every type of media. You know, come up with like the big idea, and kind of just, you know, kind of spread across everything nicely, and we were very happy with that, and it was a lot of work, it was kind of like pulling teeth to get to where it needed to be, but it was kind of the rewarding pulling teeth, you know, digging further in what this could be. [3934]
And then after a while, things were going well, and then all of a sudden, for some reason, you know, the client, was like so excited about the campaign they sent us flowers and gift certificates- [3935]
Balloons. [3936]
And stuff like that. It was like, this is it, this is great, this is gonna be the new thing. And like a week later, after they had done some research or something like that- [3937]
So the person that's supposed to have the final say, she's the one that has so much trouble. She ends up bringing a lot of different people in to get their input. It's all so clear to me now, why it's such a nightmare. It's like, "Duh!" [3257],[3256],[3233],[3232]
They did the research and started overthinking it. [3938]
Well, if you don't have the ability to understand something and say yes or no, then it just becomes a free-for-all. Too much input. [3234],[3235]
Overthinking it and all that stuff, and within like a matter of two weeks, it was like, campaign was dead, they hated it, and never wanted to- [3881],[3939],[3941],[3940],[3942]
Someone disappeared with the gift certificates. [3943]
It seems like a lot of projects start out well like that, where you will come to like, you will find the big idea, or what you think might be the good idea, and kind of the client's like, yeah, that's really good, and really interesting, they really get on board. But then they have ... Because they really haven't bought it, but it was kind of like buyer's remorse, like a week or two later. Where, I think we don't have the support to keep things sold, we kind of half sell it in, and then we don't keep it sold after that. [3882],[3947],[3944],[3945],[3946]
Where, I think we don't have the support to keep things sold, we kind of half sell it in, and then we don't keep it sold after that. [3883]
Oh, very low. They test everything. They go to almost finished commercial quality and put it into ... I forget what their format is now, or what the testing company is, but it's a Bordamatic-type situation. [3236]
We let us deal with their processes, to allow the clients, they'll have like these internal processes, that first of all, they don't want to have to make a decision. They're motivation is based on fear. I think fear's a big block to creativity, you know? So they're based on fear, they don't want to make a decision, so they have to have numbers to prove everything they do, and those numbers may be quantified, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the right thing, you know [3950]
We let us deal with their processes, to allow the clients, they'll have like these internal processes, that first of all, they don't want to have to make a decision. They're motivation is based on fear. I think fear's a big block to creativity, you know? So they're based on fear, they don't want to make a decision, so they have to have numbers to prove everything they do, and those numbers may be quantified, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the right thing, you know? [3884],[3949],[3948],[3885],[3952],[3951]
A lot of, you know, we have clients, that, you know, their bonuses are based on test scores, which have nothing to do with actual marketplace results, or the best work. You know, it's just I'll cover my ass sort of thing. So I think fear, on certain levels, whether it's within the agency or client are the biggest barriers to getting the best work done. If you had to boil it down to one word. [3953],[3954],[3955]
Yeah. And it happens there, where you have people second-guessing stuff, like the day before a meeting, and instead of just saying, like, this is our best stab at it, we second guess it, and then we go in with work that doesn't hold as well together, because it's been ... We overthink things. [3886],[3956],[3957],[3958]
Yes. The brief itself never changed, but their interpretation of it changed every meeting. [3237]
Yeah. And I think in the cases where cases have done well, it's not that to overthink. You know, people over analyzing everything. Some of these clients, they'll do like, because I worked with much- [3960],[3959],[3961]
It always ended up being a time constraint, because we could never ... Time always became a factor, because the decisions couldn't be made in time. [3258],[3239],[3259],[3238]
Oh my God, probably 20? [3240]
Oh, it was brutal. [3241]
Stouffer's was really hard, because of this woman's inability to make decisions. So while she would say she really wanted us to push her and give her strong recommendations, she didn't really want that, because she always thought she had in her head what it was she was looking for but she couldn't verbalize it. [3260],[3261]
Stouffer's was really hard, because of this woman's inability to make decisions. So while she would say she really wanted us to push her and give her strong recommendations, she didn't really want that, because she always thought she had in her head what it was she was looking for but she couldn't verbalize it. So that gets really uncomfortable after a while, when you don't finally come to a solution together and have some relief from that. So that constant friction really destroys a relationship after a while, which is what just happened, really. [3246],[3242],[3244],[3248],[3247],[3243],[3245]
We have no idea, because we knew of like, maybe three of them, but then we'd hear about other ones, later. So, I would say probably, I don't know. I would imagine there would be eight to 10 people that were making ... On the decision-making committee over there. [3962],[3963]
The team here was amazing. Actually, who you're gonna meet, Jeff ... It was he and I, basically the team on it. And we just adore each other and work really well together, and we just did the best we could. Luckily we had each other to keep us from killing ourselves. [3249]
Zero. Zero, zero. [3964]
Yeah. And that's a big issue, is the research, and the way it's pulled off, you know. A lot of nonverbal type communications can't be tested the way they test, especially quantitatively. Because there's no ... It's all about repetition and you know, and you're testing something that's not real, you know, I don't know if you're familiar with Animatics, or [Fordamatics 00:10:46]. [3965]
And they're also ... I worked with Leo Burnett for a long time, and I got so sick of testing and clients like, finally I called, I said to one of the clients, I said, okay, I think the testing they were using was ARS or one of those three other acronyms. And we actually called the company, said, can we see the commercials that you guys are testing against, you know, you're holding up whatever, as you know, the ones that kind of- [3966]
Your benchmarks, or whatever. And can you send us a reel of those? And they send, and they were terrible spots, and then we went to the client, and said, we played them for them, I said, do you want your advertising to be like that? And they were like, no. I said but that's what you're testing our stuff against. And so that was actually, I'm sorry to go off of another project, but it was another positive. That actually helped them to realize well, that's not what I want our ads to end up as. [3968],[3967]
Because we were in different ... We were brought in very early, and we helped decide the different areas and we all kind of narrow it down to what the one area should be. [3969]
It does help when you're involved, you know, in the strategic portion, too, because we're the ones that have to do the work. A lot of time's they'll hand you a brief and say, this sucks. Because they aren't actually doing the work, they don't know how to write ... They think they do, depending on who the planner is, you know. [3887],[3888],[3970]
And the clients. And very rarely do you get, the, I think the client and the agency or the planner at the agency to agree on what the brief is, even if we're like, yeah, that's pretty good. And the client will usually, yeah, but that's not what we want to say. And then it becomes a compromised version of ... It becomes kind of what we wanted and kind of what they wanted, and that's bad, because then you have two different things kind of fighting each other. [3971],[3972]
Yeah, and there's two things, and it's easy to ... It's not hard to come up with good idea stuff, if you know what you're doing. But there's two reasons why you can't. One is you don't know what you're trying to say. The other one is you're trying to say too much, you know, and that's usually what the problem is. They're either trying to say too much, or it's so convoluted in the brief, it's like, there's some abstract- [3889],[3890],[3973]
Yeah, we've seen that happen before. Or there's been times there's been like a client brief, and then an agency brief, and they're not quite aligned. [3974],[3975]
Oh, yeah. Totally. And you're like ... That's like, that's offer briefing. And they're like, what? I didn't see that brief. [3891],[3976]
And then what happens is they have so much time between when they actually start the work and go into production, they have way too much time to think about it and over analyze everything. And people don't like ... A lot of times, these clients don't like to make a decision until the last minute. [3892]
Yeah. Although it seems like because the testing is so intense with a lot of this stuff, they spend so much money and they schedule, you know, sometimes we'll get like two weeks to work on a project, but then they'll test it for six weeks. You know? And then what happens is they have so much time between when they actually start the work and go into production, they have way too much time to think about it and over analyze everything. And people don't like ... A lot of times, these clients don't like to make a decision until the last minute. [3979],[3978],[3977]
So it gives them to, you know, it's like they aren't doing their job unless they change things. [3980]
Yeah, time is always dictated. On this project, timing was dictating by when things had to be in test, instead of when it had to really be in market. [3981]
I think a lot of it was just drawing off of personal experience, I think, and just kind of relating it to, you know, how people live their lives. [3893],[3982]
Yeah, I mean, trying to think of the right word. Like, you know, having insights into the way people are, and the way they think. You know, there's archetypes that you tap into, you know, knowing that this is the way people think, because it's the way they do it ... Empirical knowledge, you know. [3894]
Yeah, everybody. If you had kids, all my kids did when they were younger, they'd be eating, and hmm. You know? And that's something that everybody experiences when you have kids. [3895],[3896]
We never had any personal contact with them, you know, it was always handled through somebody else. [3983]
So, I would say that the personal relationship was artificial. From what I can tell. [3984]
People, they don't like us. We don't like them, but we act like we do. You know, everybody likes like they kind of like each other. [3897],[3985]
We don't not like them personally, because we don't even know them. [3898],[3986]
But just, from an outside perspective, because in this case, I mean, there's times where we go to clients, and we present to clients, but in this case, we did not, and I think it was because the client also would like to keep their meetings small, and like to always have the same familiar people in the room with them. [3987],[3988]
Yeah, it was good. It was positive, it was like when it was high, everybody was high. And when things were going bad, everybody kind of felt that too. So it was like we were all in the same ship together. [3899],[3989]
No, not when we narrowed ... It wasn't, when we narrowed it down to what we wanted. You know, I think if you've been in the business long enough, you can kind of do everything. So, you know. And you know, as a creative, you kind of learn if you don't like a brief, you can just rewrite it anyways. So ... [3990],[3991]
Reference Tags
[3933] Ikea effect,[3223] Vague goals,[3250] Alignment,[3251] Communication issues,[3224] Compromising conflict about ideas,[3252] Communication issues,[3253] Indecisive leadership,[3227] Communication issues,[3226] Insufficient Feedback,[3228] Micromanaging,[3229] Trust,[3225] Woman blaming woman,[3254] Internal changes/challenges,[3230] Irreconcilable differences,[3255] Unresolved relationship conflict,[3231] Unresolved relationship conflict,[3934] Balance of challenging work,[3935] Insufficient Feedback,[3936] Insufficient Feedback,[3937] Insufficient Feedback,[3257] Yielding conflict about relationships,[3256] Indecisive leadership,[3233] Indecisive leadership,[3232] Woman blaming woman,[3938] Insufficient Feedback,[3234] Indecisive leadership,[3235] Vague roles,[3881] Indecisive leadership,[3939] Insufficient Feedback,[3941] Irreconcilable differences,[3940] Premature idea evaluation,[3942] Risk compensation,[3943] Insufficient Feedback,[3882] Indecisive leadership,[3947] Insufficient Feedback,[3944] Premature idea evaluation,[3945] Promote autonomy & sense of ownership,[3946] Risk compensation,[3883] Lack of resources,[3236] Risk compensation,[3950] Premature idea evaluation,[3884] Indecisive leadership,[3949] Indecisive leadership,[3948] Insufficient Feedback,[3885] Irreconcilable differences,[3952] Law of the instrument,[3951] Risk compensation,[3953] Law of the instrument,[3954] Premature idea evaluation,[3955] Risk compensation,[3886] Indecisive leadership,[3956] Law of the instrument,[3957] Premature idea evaluation,[3958] Risk compensation,[3237] Vague goals,[3960] Law of the instrument,[3959] Premature idea evaluation,[3961] Risk compensation,[3258] Indecisive leadership,[3239] Indecisive leadership,[3259] Planning fallacy,[3238] Unbalanced workload pressure,[3240] Believes one has a hopeful path,[3241] Believes one has a hopeful path,[3260] Communication issues,[3261] Indecisive leadership,[3246] Communication issues,[3242] Dismissive,[3244] Indecisive leadership,[3248] Insufficient Feedback,[3247] Micromanaging,[3243] Unresolved relationship conflict,[3245] Woman blaming woman,[3962] Indecisive leadership,[3963] Vague roles,[3249] Trust,[3964] Risk compensation,[3965] Law of the instrument,[3966] Law of the instrument,[3968] Insufficient Feedback,[3967] Law of the instrument,[3969] Win-win conflict about ideas,[3887] Alignment,[3888] Illusory superiority,[3970] Win-win conflict about ideas,[3971] Communication issues,[3972] Vague goals,[3889] Communication issues,[3890] Vague goals,[3973] Vague goals,[3974] Alignment,[3975] Communication issues,[3891] Communication issues,[3976] Communication issues,[3892] Indecisive leadership,[3979] Indecisive leadership,[3978] Insufficient Feedback,[3977] Planning fallacy,[3980] Insufficient Feedback,[3981] Planning fallacy,[3893] Anecdotal fallacy,[3982] Empathetic disposition,[3894] Empathetic disposition,[3895] Creative Confidence,[3896] Empathetic disposition,[3983] Communication issues,[3984] Communication issues,[3897] Alignment,[3985] Unresolved relationship conflict,[3898] Negativity bias,[3986] Unresolved relationship conflict,[3987] Communication issues,[3988] Trust,[3899] Organizing effectively,[3989] Trust,[3990] Forceful conflict about ideas,[3991] Illusory superiority

related tags

Sign Up and Start Learning

ABOUT ME
MADISON BARNETT
I get my inspiration from the fictional world. I’m a social geek. Completely exploit 24/365 catalysts for change whereas high standards in action items. Conveniently whiteboard multifunctional benefits without enabled leadership.
GET IN TOUCH
Quickly communicate covalent niche markets for maintainable sources. Collaboratively harness resource sucking experiences whereas cost effective meta-services.